Comments on: mixed feelings about television shows

By: neilhell

neilhell — Wed, 25 Oct 2006 15:09:45 +0000

To clarify terms:
Hazing is more a practice of higher status peers exerting pressure on lower status peers inside a social group (sports team, frat, book club) as a form of initiation. The idea is that the frosh or whatever goes through various kinds of abuse, and cognitively, it brings him or her to the opinion that if he/she is willing to go through such abuse, it must be for a really good reason, usually how awesome the organization is. That’s why it’s called ‘hazing,’ because the abuse creates a haze of appeal to beloningness and comradery with fellow abusees, and, typically, instills a desire to give it back to the next lower status fucks that come along.

What the coach is doing here is more like the abuse or “training” doled out to members of a military unit, where they find team cohesion through undergoing mutual strain. Since the commands are coming from above, not from a high status peer but an authority, the kids can band together to play as a team on the field, or shoot people with impunity.

so, for this community, where their home life is imbalanced, you’re at least giving them the balance of “The Team” to provide a stabilitzing influence (not too different from what Army recruiters do so succesfully in middle-lower income areas) Maybe the school’s math and english teachers should take the kids from their homes and make them do short essays and quadratic equations in the middle of the woods, just to cover all the bases.

By: manlio

manlio — Wed, 25 Oct 2006 01:29:09 +0000

yes! it was! and my point is, when you’re playing the midnight sprint scene as a triumphant homage to team and spirit, i think you’re encouraging that imbalance, which i find troubling.

By: superkb

superkb — Wed, 25 Oct 2006 01:00:59 +0000

Just to carry this on a bit longer… isn’t a major theme of the show (and the movie and the book) that these kids are not growing up in a well balanced environment? Academics are far from the forefront of anyone’s agenda (except for maybe Coach Taylor’s wife).

Maybe I should go do something other than watch TV tonight?

By: manlio

manlio — Tue, 24 Oct 2006 17:31:00 +0000

well, i definitely don’t agree that there was no potential for harm for the kids involved. they’re doing sprints up a hill in the rain across a sewer/swamp. all it takes is for one of them to slip and fall down in the water and get trampled and it’s game over. and it’s midnight. on a school night. what about the potential harm to their classes/concentration the next day?

Have you ever seen “Coach Carter”? That for me is an example of teaching kids respect (and promoting academic integrity, very little of which has been mentioned so far in FNL except for the QB having to drop pre-cal in order to potentially play second string to the new kid from NO) for the game and themselves, without making the sport (basketball in this case) their only priority in life. haven’t seen that yet with FNL. still seems like it’s promoting the idea that it’s ok to live football and ignore other concerns.

By: alex

alex — Tue, 24 Oct 2006 15:24:26 +0000

I will have to respectufully disagree. I don’t think that was hazing at all. The best example of hazing I can think of is the whole fraternity process – having to endure torment in order to be accepted and ultimatley, torment others.

What Coach Taylor was doing was coaching and I think his “You think that just because you get free pie when you walk into the diner, you’re a champion…” speech really summed it up well. These kids have an unbelievable sense of entitlement because of the unifrom they wear, not for their accomplishments, which in a big way disrespects the game. That was no secret to anyone. Once Smash Williams publicly declared his sentiments it reflected very poorly on Coach Taylor and his program in general. In that light I don’t think “hazing” is an appropriate term. He was teaching the kids respect for the game and themselves. Clearly the loss was a huge deal in the town and the season is at somewhat of a crossroads so he needed to kick the coaching into overdrive if he wanted to make an impression on these guys and turn things around.

Also, I think hazing can often imply “potential for harm” to the people involved. In this case, there was none. It was hard and some of them puked, etc… but its nothing they shouldn’t be able to do.

I think Taylor was just using the Midnight Sprints to remind everyone of what they’re actually capable of, not just what they “feel like” doing. While everyone could probably benefit from a proverbial Midnight Sprint every once in a while, selfish high school students might be the most ripe for it.

By: manlio

manlio — Tue, 24 Oct 2006 00:03:34 +0000

I should note, for everyone else’s comprehension, that /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ means “making out” in the lexicon that karen, myself, and a few others share.

By: superkb

superkb — Mon, 23 Oct 2006 18:37:32 +0000

hmm, you’re right. i didn’t read that properly. i started to think “that’s not what i got from it” and then went on to something else entirely, like / \ / \.

By: manlio

manlio — Mon, 23 Oct 2006 17:21:54 +0000

I wasn’t saying that it was unrealistic, only that showing that part as a “triumphant” moment seems to support the idea that hazing at all hours for high school students is productive, which i don’t believe is something we as a society should be encouraging.

By: superkb

superkb — Mon, 23 Oct 2006 16:09:11 +0000

I disagree. I think last week’s show was more about how Coach Taylor (I heart him) needs to teach his team a little respect. Aside from it being midnight when the team was called out for wind sprints, I found the scene to be “some what” realistic for a high school that holds sports at such a high level of importance.

However, I do have issues with the cheerleader beating up the best friend and then falling into a makeout. It’s just absurd.